Trump also said Carlson had called to apologize for comments that were “a little bit too strong.”
Sen. Ted Cruz and conservative talk show host Tucker Carlson got into a heated exchange in a sit-down interview for Carlson’s program, highlighting the infighting among supporters of President Donald Trump as he appears poised to take direct military action on Iran.
Tensions between the U.S. and Iran skyrocketed in the past week, following Israel’s attack on the country’s top military leaders and nuclear facilities. On Tuesday, Trump appeared to signal increased U.S. involvement in Israel’s campaign, claiming on Truth Social that “we now have complete and total control of the skies over Iran.”
As the U.S. stands on the precipice of direct engagement in another major conflagration in the Middle East — which Trump, historically an isolationist, had long promised to avoid — a growing rift has emerged within the GOP over isolationists and interventionists, including between Carlson and Cruz (R-Texas), an outspoken Iran hawk.
Over the course of nearly two hours, the conversation between the two conservatives continued to grow increasingly tense, with both men shouting at each other at certain times and hurling insults. Trump also weighed in on the podcast from the Oval Office on Wednesday afternoon — seeming to take no definitive side of either ally following the heated dispute.
“Tucker is a nice guy. He called and apologized the other day, because he thought he said things that were a little bit too strong, and I appreciated that,” Trump said in response to a reporter’s question about the interview. “And Ted Cruz is a nice guy. He’s been with me for a long time.”
In a preview clip of the conversation between the two, which Carlson posted on social media, the former Fox News host grilled Cruz on his knowledge of Iran, attacking the senator for not knowing “anything about the country.”
At first, Carlson launched a softball at Cruz, asking how many people live in Iran. Cruz didn’t know the answer.
“You don’t know the population of the country you seek to topple?” Carlson asked, later pressing, “How could you not know that?”
Cruz sloughed off the interrogation, replying: “I don’t sit around memorizing population tables.”
But the interaction began to get heated as Carlson got increasingly frustrated by Cruz’s apparent lack of knowledge.
“Well it’s kind of relevant because you’re calling for the overthrow of the government,” Carlson shot back, before suggesting that Cruz doesn’t “know anything about the country.”
“I didn’t say I don’t know anything about the country,” Cruz said.
“Okay, what’s the ethnic mix of Iran?” Carlson asked, prompting a pause from the senator.
“They are Persians and predominantly Shia,” Cruz offered, getting defensive as Carlson cut in to ask “What percent?”
“You don’t know anything about Iran!” Carlson said, as the two men began yelling over each other. “You’re a senator who is calling for the overthrow of the government and you don’t know anything about the country!”
Cruz lashed back out, throwing the same accusation back at Carlson and saying that the conservative host “claims they’re not trying to murder Donald Trump” and “can’t figure out if it was a good idea to kill Gen. Soleimani.”
As the less than two-minute clip went viral Tuesday night, Cruz went on the defensive on X, saying Carlson had released only a “snippet playing a ‘gotcha’ on the population of Iran.”
“I declined to play that silly game,” Cruz said, urging viewers to “WATCH the full 2-hr interview,” which went live later Wednesday.
As the two continued to discuss America’s relationship with Israel, Carlson asked Cruz about the role of the American Israel Public Affairs Committee and how, if at all, it influences Congress. Cruz turned the tables and said Carlson is “obsessed” with Israel.
But tensions peaked when Cruz implied Carlson’s criticism of Israel was rooted in antisemitism.
“You’re not talking about the Chinese, you’re not talking about the Japanese, you’re not talking about the British, you’re not talking about the French. The question, what about the Jews? What about the Jews? You’re asking, why are the Jews controlling our foreign policy? That’s what you just asked,” Cruz said to Carlson.
“I don’t see a lawmaker’s job as defending the interests of a foreign government, including the ones that my ancestors come from,” Carlson said. “That does not make me an antisemite. And shame on you for suggesting otherwise. And I mean that.“
After the interview was posted, Cruz repeatedly posted to X clips of him fighting with Carlson and memes mocking the former Fox News host, including reposting an X user praising Cruz for hitting Carlson for “his thinly veiled antisemitism.”
When asked on Capitol Hill Wednesday if he regretted going on Carlson’s show, Cruz said “not remotely.”
In an episode of his own podcast, “Verdict with Ted Cruz,” released on Wednesday, Cruz said that while he and Carlson agree on “80 percent of the issues,” the former Fox News host has “gone off the rails” on foreign policy.
“On foreign policy, Tucker has gone back-crap crazy. He’s gone off the rails. He is suddenly a hardcore isolationist,” Cruz said.
As the isolationist vs. interventionist battle heats up among conservatives, Cruz staked out a third position.
“Traditionally, there have been two poles in Republican foreign policy analysis: interventionists and isolationists,” Cruz said. “I think they’re both wrong. I consider myself a third point in the triangle — I am a non-interventionist hawk. I am very reluctant to engage in military conflict, just like Trump is. But I also believe in peace through strength. The best way you avoid war is being strong enough that your enemies don’t want to stand up to you.”
Jake Traylor and Mia McCarthy contributed to this report.
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